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+--- Thread: Aircraft and the Twin Towers (/thread-13397.html)
Aircraft and the Twin Towers - Tracy Riddle - 18-12-2014
I think the clip in the first post is from September Clues, which is an interesting documentary but pretty far-fetched.
Aircraft and the Twin Towers - Charles Keeble - 19-12-2014
A couple of points the video makes:
1. the vantage point is above the roof or we wouldn't see it
2. it seems to be stationary
I'm not at all familiar with NYC, so I don't have a clue what city block a stationary something would have to be above to take that video. The smoke doesn't appear to be moving real fast. Maybe a helicopter could be that still. Don't know.
So those things just leave me with some questions:
Satellites can take pictures from a long way off, but how far?
Can they take video?
Is live coverage a satellite (node in a communication network) feed?
Didn't somebody who was in Florida at the time later say they saw video of the first one?
Who controls the communications?
I might just try to start a business manufacturing National Security Tissues.
Aircraft and the Twin Towers - Lauren Johnson - 19-12-2014
Quote:1. the vantage point is above the roof or we wouldn't see it
2. it seems to be stationary
My guess is that the shot to open the film was taken from the Empire State Building, which is directly north of the Twin Towers. The view is from North to South.
Aircraft and the Twin Towers - Peter Lemkin - 19-12-2014
Lauren Johnson Wrote:Quote:1. the vantage point is above the roof or we wouldn't see it
2. it seems to be stationary
My guess is that the shot to open the film was taken from the Empire State Building, which is directly north of the Twin Towers. The view is from North to South.
But, the Empire State Building, being lower than the WTC towers is NOT high enough to get that vantage point. It can't be any satellite - and could only be a plane or helicopter - one not known about and with some very special visual stabilization equipment. If it is real, I'd posit that it was filmed by the perpetrators themselves. It is a mystery shot, for sure....but so much of the evidence in the case is problematic - as impossible or highly improbable - often with unknown provenience. These are the hallmarks of a covert operation.
Aircraft and the Twin Towers - David Guyatt - 19-12-2014
Optical Image Stabilization (OIS):
Quote:Abbreviated as OIS, optical image stabilization is the apparatus, contained within a digital camera or other digital recording device, that compensates in real-time for shaking and vibrating while recording. Because OIS is a real-time compensation there is no alterations or image degradation to the image.
Aircraft and the Twin Towers - Peter Lemkin - 19-12-2014
David Guyatt Wrote:Optical Image Stabilization (OIS):
Quote:Abbreviated as OIS, optical image stabilization is the apparatus, contained within a digital camera or other digital recording device, that compensates in real-time for shaking and vibrating while recording. Because OIS is a real-time compensation there is no alterations or image degradation to the image.
yes, but....that is a fairly new technology [post-911, I believe] and mostly applicable to still photography, rather than motion video....it can compensate for vibration, slight movements of camera and/or object, but not vertical or horizontal motion of where the camera is [as for example in a helicopter]. If this was used before release in the public domain, it would further point to military/intelligence assets using it - as they usually have such things a few years before its known or available in public. I think, however, if real, this was filmed from a non-moving platform - or one moving level toward or away from the optical target [i.e. again having some foreknowledge]. Images can also be somewhat 'stabilized' after the fact now using digital processing...but again the same caveats apply as that done in a device.
Aircraft and the Twin Towers - Tracy Riddle - 19-12-2014
Now that I look at it more carefully, it's not from September Clues. It's funny I never thought about where that first shot might have been filmed from. It's definitely higher than the Twin Towers. Too steady for a helicopter. I doubt they would have any reason for using some kind of Steadi-Cam setup.
Aircraft and the Twin Towers - David Guyatt - 20-12-2014
Peter Lemkin Wrote:David Guyatt Wrote:Optical Image Stabilization (OIS):
Quote:Abbreviated as OIS, optical image stabilization is the apparatus, contained within a digital camera or other digital recording device, that compensates in real-time for shaking and vibrating while recording. Because OIS is a real-time compensation there is no alterations or image degradation to the image.
yes, but....that is a fairly new technology [post-911, I believe] and mostly applicable to still photography, rather than motion video....it can compensate for vibration, slight movements of camera and/or object, but not vertical or horizontal motion of where the camera is [as for example in a helicopter]. If this was used before release in the public domain, it would further point to military/intelligence assets using it - as they usually have such things a few years before its known or available in public. I think, however, if real, this was filmed from a non-moving platform - or one moving level toward or away from the optical target [i.e. again having some foreknowledge]. Images can also be somewhat 'stabilized' after the fact now using digital processing...but again the same caveats apply as that done in a device.
I'm not sure that is the case. I saw a TV clip many, many years ago that showed this technology in operation. It was used by a TV camera in the African bush mounted on a 4 x 4 shooting footage to the rear out of the back of the Land Rover. In the first run without the OIS operating it was the bumpy jumpy footage you'd expect from live action. In the second clip with OIS activated (the same run btw), it was perfectly smooth and stable - no bumps, jumps, vibrations or jolts at all.
It can't say how long ago this was, but it was a long time.
Aircraft and the Twin Towers - Peter Lemkin - 20-12-2014
David Guyatt Wrote:Peter Lemkin Wrote:David Guyatt Wrote:Optical Image Stabilization (OIS):
Quote:Abbreviated as OIS, optical image stabilization is the apparatus, contained within a digital camera or other digital recording device, that compensates in real-time for shaking and vibrating while recording. Because OIS is a real-time compensation there is no alterations or image degradation to the image.
yes, but....that is a fairly new technology [post-911, I believe] and mostly applicable to still photography, rather than motion video....it can compensate for vibration, slight movements of camera and/or object, but not vertical or horizontal motion of where the camera is [as for example in a helicopter]. If this was used before release in the public domain, it would further point to military/intelligence assets using it - as they usually have such things a few years before its known or available in public. I think, however, if real, this was filmed from a non-moving platform - or one moving level toward or away from the optical target [i.e. again having some foreknowledge]. Images can also be somewhat 'stabilized' after the fact now using digital processing...but again the same caveats apply as that done in a device.
I'm not sure that is the case. I saw a TV clip many, many years ago that showed this technology in operation. It was used by a TV camera in the African bush mounted on a 4 x 4 shooting footage to the rear out of the back of the Land Rover. In the first run without the OIS operating it was the bumpy jumpy footage you'd expect from live action. In the second clip with OIS activated (the same run btw), it was perfectly smooth and stable - no bumps, jumps, vibrations or jolts at all.
It can't say how long ago this was, but it was a long time.
Even if so, as there were no buildings taller than the WTC where was the camera? If in a helicopter, why no trace of it? If in a plane, it would be very hard to hide the motion of the plane changing the angle of view. Satellites wouldn't be possible at that angle or clarity....so what was the platform?!
Aircraft and the Twin Towers - Magda Hassan - 20-12-2014
Peter Lemkin Wrote:....so what was the platform?!
Drone?